Volvo Penta AQ170 water in oil.

woywoyboy	My Volvo Penta 170hp B30 has water in the oil I discovered this today when she wouldn't start. I removed all the plugs as I thought I had flooded it and discovered water in the chambers. I then had a look in the rocker cover cap and saw it looked like lithium grease. Next I dropped the sump plug and out gushed a lot of water with the oil. What may have caused this ? Do I need "flush" the motor in any way before replacing the oil ? Anything else I should be aware of ? Can I fix it ? Thank you all.	2002-06-14
woywoyboy	Further thought: water was only noticeable in 1&2. The water pump made funny rattling sound like a shot bearing does last week when it was last run.	2002-06-14
woywoyboy	Look out, the old brain is going here as I watch Thunderbirds with my kids (it is 0600hs here). Would a compression test eliminate the head gasket?	2002-06-14
G DANE	WoyWoyboy The water pump ( Camshaft driven ) has a seal, separating freshwater from motor oil. If your axel in pump is worn, seal won't last. I had to change my axel to get rid of leak. If you have water in cylinders as well, it is probably head gasket. The reason for the "cylindermayonaice" on camcap is water in oil, but can occur when running short trips when oil doesn't warm up. Glad to hear you still have the old B30th I thought it was only here. Try to do a compression test - I guess 1 and 2 are lower. If you loosen camcap when running you should get a steam up from there. You could do a search for replies from GENE70 - it seems he has a lot of experience and offers people to call him for advise - VERY nice guy !	2002-06-14
woywoyboy	Thank you G Dane. I shall follow your suggestions. Is there any way to test the pump seal ? Can you also advise me re head bolt torque specs ? I have searched for this topic and from what I can make out it points to the head gasket but I really would like some assurance that it is only something minor like a gasket. I am taking my kids to our caravan this morning and will otherwise worry myself silly. After all, this is my boat we are talking about, and you all know what that means !	2002-06-14
Spidybot	Hi woywoyboy (og davs G Dane) A B30..? Wow, used to have a couple of those years back. Not to spoil your day, but those engines really weren't Volvo's biggest hit. The 'E'(injected) series even worse than the carbureted. Volvo had their legendary B18 and B20 series and needed a 6-banger for the car known as 164. They simply added 2 cylinders and prolonged shafts etc. The engine was marine converted but never really reached the reputation of the smaller Volvo's. As you might know, this was the largest block Volvo made by themselves - all V8's were made on US (GM) blocks. Those days all Volvo blocks were cast in England. If your gasket is blown, you'll want to know why it did. If you remove the head, the only wise thing is to have it all renovated. When you're at it check your exhaust manifold and all other related parts. This was the point where I decided to accept an offer from the workshop to replace the B30 by a AQ145 4-banger with OH cam, heat exchanger and all. Almost same cost. It went right in, connected to the drive and performed almost as good (maybe the 170 wasn't up to full performance) at a much better mpg - also due to the lower weight. I decided to stick to Volvo although Merc made a very attractive offer because the cutout in the transom is larger for Volvo and I didn't want to have to rebuild that as well. Just make sure you get a picture of the total cost before you start. After all it's an old lady and you wouldn't want to pay the price of a replacement just to keep the old thing running.	2002-06-15
woywoyboy	Thanks UU, can you advise me compression figures and also head bolt torqueing spec ? If the compression tests OK, what else should I look at ?	2002-06-16
Spidybot	Volvo made 4 versions. 170A from 1969-72, 170B from 1972-73, 170C from 1973-78 and 170D from 1978-80. They came with the 250, 270, 270T, 280 or 280T outdrive. There are three different head gaskets (different thicknesses) and oval in stead of round holes. Those days in Sweden a used head for it costs around $600. Of course shipping to the US will add severely - and still it may need some work before fitting. Some are fitted with oversize valves to help performance. Compression when new was 10:1, it's 2.978 litre volume, approx 23.5 kpm torque at 2500 RPM. Compression should read about the same on all cyls. although not necessarily a full 10. I'll have to do some searching to get the torque figures so be patient. Apart from the already mentioned regarding head, valves, valve seats, obvious faults in rockers etc., I'd like to be sure to find the reason why the gasket blew. If you have cracks in the cylinder head or the block or if the head is somehow no longer sitting perfectly tight on the block, you have to get a renovation the complete head. valves etc. The exhaust manifold connects to a bended piece - by Volvo called 'the elbow' (where exhaust and cooling water it mixed on the way out). Check that one as well. When I had the problem I wasn't up to that much DIY on the engine, but today I think I'd spend the time to check compression and lift off the head to see what's in it. Once removed you can take it to a specialist workshop for advice/offer. In my case there were too many dark horses - even before digging into the details. The bargain I got on the new engine was only slightly over the calculated repair price and I really wanted the more modern AQ145. Alone the freshwater cooling was tempting.	2002-06-16
woywoyboy	Tx again UU. Mine is a 170A mated to a 270 leg. I am waiting on my shop to provide me with repowering options but in the mean time I am going to lift the head and at least have a look. Reckon I'll start with manifold first and the head.	2002-06-16
G DANE	Woywoyboy My brother in law had the same problem with his AQ170, in a Fletcher 17' . The head was warped a bit, probably due to a little overheating sometimes, but all the valves looked OK. The valves got grinded a little bit with carborundum powder, the head was corrected at a cylinder shop and bolted back on again. He ran it for 3 years, doing a lot of skiing, and later on sold the boat, never heard of any problems since. Fore some reason some of these corrodes at gasket edge, on outer cylinder walls, you have to be sure this is not the problem. If it is, it is cheap to get an automobile block, and move all your crank, head and stuff to that. Remember, only use marine head gasket, the steel enforcement on auto will rust and the gasket will blow in a year or so. I would start at head gasket. Good luck.	2002-06-17
Spidybot	Here goes for head torques: If you look at the engine from the front end (that is when the fan belt is towards you), you'll see 14 bolts on the head. Number these 1-7 on the left side and 8-14 on the right side. Make sure all threads are clean and oiled. Tighten the bolts SEQUENTIALLY in this order: 4-11-10-3-5-12-9-2-6-13-8-1-7-14 in three steps according to these torques: First tighten to 40 nm = 4 kpm Second tighten to 80 nm = 8 kpm Run the engine at low RPM for 10 minutes. Third tighten to 90 nm = 9 kpm G Dane's right. Sometimes those fixes are not too complicated. On the other hand, several hours of work and the money... G Danes' brother in law only got three years out of it. Think about it.	2002-06-17
Spidybot	BTW: Remember to check diesel options. Modern diesels have a lot to offer.	2002-06-17
Spidybot	Woywoyboy Not until now did I notice you're an Ozzie. Sorry 'bout that. Which part? If you should get the idea of using a head from the Volvo 164 (which basically has the same engine), keep in mind that cooling channels may differ. Volvo did something to cope with the changed conditions on the marine engines.	2002-06-17
woywoyboy	Tx again UU. I just spoke with my dealer and he said I won't be getting much change out of $9000 for a new repower so a diesel is certainly something I will be looking at. He also suggested first examining the sea water pump seals before even worrying about a compression test - both of which I am about to go and do right now. He also said to bring it in and he'll have a sticky. I am indeed from Oz - Wollongong actually. Home of the Wollongong Windowlicker. I will report back this evening after checking the above.	2002-06-18
woywoyboy	Only got a cursory examination in before I decided it was too cold to be outside tinkering with boats (must have been all of 15 deg C. Never mind that my confidence was decreasing with the hour - I rang a friend who works at one of the local outboard dealer/repairers and he put me onto one of his colleagues who said "oh f^%$ Windowlicker, I've 'ad about 3 of those things and you can't kill 'em with a #@%&^* stone. What's wrong with the $%^& ?" I told him and he said "gotta be a %#^^ head gasket. We don't want the %^&(#@ thing here but the boss is havin' both of his Mercruisers rebuilt by this bloke. I'll have him call you and we'll supply him the parts at the right price. He'll do good work and he won't rip you off." Bloke is a local auto repair guy and I will report back when he has had a look. Tx again G Dane and UU.	2002-06-18
Spidybot	Won't go into my traveling memorandum, but suddenly it all starts to sound very Ozzy. Have a couple of friends in Adelaide who specialize in getting cars++ flying. To my experience creativity is very good down under. Let's hear how it goes. Have a good one.	2002-06-18
woywoyboy	UU, these would these blokes happen to enjoy driving long blue cars over large salt lakes at very high speeds ?	2002-06-18
Spidybot	It's more like cruising any road, attempting to keep the car straight. Cars looking pretty normal on the outside but.. lots of turbo's and intercoolers and other gizmo's under the hood. Also scooters going like rockets..	2002-06-18
woywoyboy	Finally got motivated (only took a slab). Compression test returns the following: 1: 0 PSI 2:90 PSI 3:175 PSI 4:175 PSI 5:170 PSI 6:165 PSI Off with the head !	2002-06-20
woywoyboy	Got the head off. Definitely the gasket. Had a big piece missing. Off to the machine shop with it and then back on. Should I use a gasket sealing compound and also put it around the bolts ? Should I replace the head bolts ?	2002-06-21
Spidybot	If the bolts are still in good shape there's no reason to replace them. I'd use a little (!) compound to cope with minor scratches in the surfaces but just a thin line. Check my previous post regarding torques. I think it's important to clean and oil the threads as the torque setting must no be affected by dirt. Also remember that valve clearance should be as specified - better a little too distant than too close. Did you find any signs of leaking around the water pump?	2002-06-21
woywoyboy	No signs of leaking around the water pump UU. Head gasket arrived today and the head will be available tomorrow morning after a surface grind at the local machine shop.	2002-06-24
Spidybot	Sounds good. After all you're on the way. Take your time and put the old lady back together with great care. Hopefully it all didn't cost you an arm and a leg?	2002-06-24
Spidybot	BTW: Just browsed your site. How's that Commodore for towing?	2002-06-24
Mish_Mish	You web page is like some kind of porn site, it kills with the pop-ups. Anyways, early Volvo V6 motors were designed and built by Renault and you know how those French are, besides their vine and cheese they are good at nothing:) I know from my car repair days that V6 Volvos always had blown head gaskets. You will need to machine shop these heads to make sure that they are not warp, because as I recall heads and the block are aluminum on this motor.	2002-06-24
woywoyboy	Sorry 'bout the pop-ups Mish_Mish but the site was my first effort and the free host has pop-ups. I will be moving it to another when time permits. Anyways, it's just another way for us to have a laugh at ourselves. UU the Commodore has an 1800kg towing kit fitted and the rig comes in at just under when loaded. She has plenty of power both going and stopping. I understand it will probably shorten the life of the car but when it is part of a salary package one tends to not give a stuff. How on earth did you pick it as a Commodore from the pic? Costs were pretty good I thought, $125 for head gasket and $60 for head machining. Toss is a penny for oil, plugs and the like and it hits 'bout AU$220, which is close to US$3.50. (in reality about US$100.) When doing labour myself it takes more time but is somehow very satisfying. Will I need observe any kind of "running in" period? I shall report back tomorrow when all is fitted.	2002-06-24
Spidybot	The car is visible on one of the pics and a Holden Commodore is about the only one looking this way. So. Also, I had one for my Ozzy cruise (6000 km in 30 days), so I know what it's like. By the way, seems to be important to keep wheel alignment up to it's best to get a comfortable ride and handling. It is true that Volvo's V6 were made in coop with Renault and Peugeot/Citrodn. But that was after the B30 which is straight 6 and, as mentioned, is a proplonged B20. The B27 is a V6 and was used in the 264. Not very good, one must admit, and not in use anymore by any of the parties. Running in is always to be considered. I'd take it easy and keep low RPM for a good while, watching it closely. Temperature, oil and weird sounds. Remember the recommended routine about head bolts fitting and torque. And forever after give it and extra oil check now and then. You seem to end up with a fair cost - which is good considering the 'ol thing may or may not have suffered in other parts.	2002-06-25
woywoyboy	When were you in Oz UU? I sure would like to hear more about your travels! I also would like to say thank you for all your help in getting this old girl up and ready again. I very much appreciate it. I picked up the head this afternoon and will fit it in the morning.	2002-06-25
Spidybot	As the short version of my Oz travel resume is about one hour (and that's just for the latest trip), we better move the conversation out of this forum. Let me have your email. Leave it at [edited] and I'll reply asap.	2002-06-25
woywoyboy	All now back together but need to adjust valve clearances. Can anyone advise these specs please ?	2002-06-27
woywoyboy	Never find thanks. Found them . 0.20 and 0.22.	2002-06-27
woywoyboy	Done. All together and running. Thanks to all for helping out.	2002-06-28
woywoyboy	I took her for her first run last week and she went well. Onboard was my neighbor, and auto mechanic. Upon returning and cleaning up I had a look inside the rocker cover and as expected the oil was milky. My mate said that was to be expected as some water would still be in the motor. No worries. Yesterday I changed the oil and filter again and ran her on the flusher for 15- 20 minutes and again the oil was milky. Is this acceptable on the 2nd oil change ? Would water still be in there ? Compression is fine and I did the seals on the seawater pump before reassembling her for good measure. Exhaust manifold is less than 12 months old so I hope that is not the prob. Any suggestions please ?	2002-07-21

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